Greg Gorman Talks New Book Projects and Why Only John Waters Trusts Him To Photograph His Corpse

Celebrity photographer Greg Gorman sits down with Paris Chong to discuss his upcoming books, the end of commercial photography due to digital and AI, and the secrets behind his legendary Hollywood dinner parties.

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Celebrated photographer Greg Gorman sits down with Paris Chong to discuss his current work, which includes an unannounced two-volume set of books dedicated to David Bowie and Grace Jones, both of whom he photographed for many years. He also shares that he, Matthew Ralston, and Herb Ritts are planning an upcoming project and book with Fahey Klein Gallery, stemming from their time in the "School of LA". Gorman, who is represented by Fahey Klein, details his busy schedule, which includes teaching at SVA in New York and running portraiture workshops in Maine and Aspen, Colorado.

Gorman offers a candid critique of the photography industry, explaining that he made a conscious choice to step back from commercial work around 2006/2007, feeling he had "been there, done that". He attributes this change to the rise of digital and AI, which allowed producers to hire "Greg Gorman lookalikes" for a fraction of the price and use editing to mimic his style. His focus throughout his career has been on creating a "connected portrait"—getting inside the person's head to capture "a sense of the soul of who that individual was". He is the only person John Waters trusts to photograph his corpse, famously joking that Gorman would know he'd "need proper time for hair and makeup".

Beyond his iconic black and white photography—known for its harsh lighting, strong highlights, hard shadows, and sculptured look—Gorman recounts the legendary status of his eclectic Hollywood dinner parties. He describes mixing guests like Bette Midler, David Bowie, and John Waters with "a hustler from Santa Monica Boulevard" and the popular, but unexpected, presence of Heidi Fleiss. Gorman also shares his history with Studio 54 and his connection to the late photographer Francesco Scavullo.

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Episode Timestamps

00:00 Show Intro and Guest
00:43 New Books Bowie and Grace
01:57 John Waters Quote Talk
03:13 Leica Versus Sony Gear
05:38 Travel Wine and Workshops
07:46 Portrait Philosophy and Industry
19:22 Factory Days Memories
19:56 Studio 54 First Night
20:10 Francesco Scavullo Fan Talk
22:06 Favorite Photographers Ethics
23:58 Legacy Foundation Iconic Warhol
28:56 Travel Festivals Workshops Farewell

Links to Greg Gorman

Greg Gorman's Website
Greg's Instagram
Greg's Wikipedia
Greg's Facebook
Faihey Klein Gallery - Greg Gorman
LAC Photo - Profile

🎵 Music by Andrew Raiher

📸 Shot & Edited at Visible Audio Studios

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Okay.

Alright.

Paris Chong: Hi everybody. It's. Paris Chong, and I'm really excited to tell you who my next guest is because I was just so happy he said yes, he'd be on the show 'cause he is a very famous photographer, the handsome and talented Greg Gorman.

Greg Gorman: What can I say? After that intro? I was happy to be on your show.

I adore you Paris. I love coming to the gallery and seeing the shows and stuff. So when you asked me, I was immediate, yes.

Paris Chong: Aw, I was happy you said that. I love that. I love your work. So, uh, what are you working on right this minute?

Greg Gorman: Well, at the moment I'm basically working on, we'll see how it all goes, but I'm basically having, uh, one of my assistants, actually not one of my assistants, one of the gals from, uh, FAHE Klein scan my next two books, and I'm gonna try to do it as a.

Two volume set. This hasn't really been announced or anything, but I'm trying to do a book on Grace Jones and David Bowie, both of whom I shot for a number of years.

Paris Chong: I love both of those people. I know. And you got to see, yeah, they're both two pretty, you know, I used to get to big in the music business.

Amazing. Yeah. I used to get to hang out with Grace back in the day in my Miami days, and, uh, he, she always was at Chris Blackwell's. Uh, yeah, they're very close at the hotel and one time I just shouted out. Where's my champagne? My mouth is dry. And she goes, who said that? And I said, I was like, she's like, it's me.

So she used to sit on my left.

Greg Gorman: We always had a couple of bottles of crystal. Yeah. After she submerged her head in a bucket of ice water to tighten everything up.

Paris Chong: Wow. She's like one of my heroes. She's still a

Greg Gorman: trip.

Paris Chong: Yeah. She's so gorgeous, so beautiful. And David Bowie. Oh, he's such a, I love the picture you took of him.

That's on your, uh.

Greg Gorman: Oh yeah. Well there's

Paris Chong: a bunch of, and you take a lot of pictures of Elton John or Elton John,

Greg Gorman: shot Elton for many years,

Paris Chong: and John Waters who we were just talking about. Okay. So I pulled, I thought this was such a great quote. 'cause I, I, and I also forgot that John's also from Marilyn, like.

Right mixed stringer. I, so it says, he said, I don't want my picture taken when I'm dead, but if it, I kick the bucket in in public when I'm old and don't leave a good looking corpse. Please call Greg Gorman so he can use his camera and get a the scene and upstage the creeps. Who we are trying to take selfies with.

My corpse. He'll know. He'll know I'll need proper time for hair and makeup. What's the hurry? So you're the only person he would let. Shoot him if he passed on.

Greg Gorman: I'd never heard that quote that you just read. The one that, uh, he wrote, I think in one of my books was something that I was the only person who let photograph his corpse.

But that's great.

Paris Chong: Have you ever photographed someone's corpse?

Greg Gorman: No, not really. I mean, I've, you know, had couple what you think about that, a couple friends that have passed away and I've taken a snap. But no, it's nothing I'm really too interested in doing, I would say. What

Paris Chong: did you think of Matthew Ralston's book?

Vanitas With All,

Greg Gorman: I love Matthew's work. I think

Paris Chong: its great. Isn't

Greg Gorman: insane. Yeah.

Paris Chong: Yeah. He was here too. I'm so lucky. I've had both of you here.

Greg Gorman: Yeah, Matthew's really talented. Matthew and Herb and I all were kind of the school of la Matthew probably talked about that. We're gonna have a project upcoming at uh, Fay Klein, and hopefully a book with that too.

Paris Chong: Oh really? When.

Greg Gorman: Um, I don't know the dates

Paris Chong: it is. Are you represented by Fahe Klein?

Greg Gorman: Yes, I have been from the beginning of my career. Years. Years, yeah. Since 82 or something like that. Yeah.

Paris Chong: Fahe Klein has some of the best photographers and you know, it's unfortunate, uh, that we can't work together because I can only show, uh, Leica.

I know it

Greg Gorman: a gallery. You I have to. Well, you know, it's so funny, but you borrow anything Becausecause? Several, well, several of your photographers that you've shown have taken their work and rephotographed it with a like, I mean, they've all beat her up. One person, one person that we know we won't talk about, but uh.

To get around it. You know, I'm just not a hypocritical person and I don't want to be, you know, I think likes are great. I had a Laika for a while. Uh, I had like an M five a long time ago, but, uh, you know, I'm, I know I'm sponsored by camera companies, so, and I'm happy. So, you know,

Paris Chong: would you ever wanna just, uh, try one and see,

Greg Gorman: well, you know, I shot a little bit with the, um.

With the medium format one, the S two or whatever it was called. Mm-hmm. And it was great. S SL two.

Paris Chong: Well, you could borrow anything you want.

Greg Gorman: Yeah.

Paris Chong: If you have a

Greg Gorman: specific, I mean, I think the camera that of, that you guys make that I think is really interesting is a monochromatic

Paris Chong: Oh yeah.

Greg Gorman: Camera. That to me is the most interesting.

Paris Chong: Well, it has to be 80% like a, like a, so you, because, and not everybody uses just the one camera. Most photographers don't. You know, you have to. Like Mitch was just saying, you have to use different things for different events and

Greg Gorman: some, if they'd gimme one to keep, I'd probably consider it.

Paris Chong: I wish they'd give everyone.

Greg Gorman: still don't have one. I know. That's the big thing. I think. I don't really, I, you know, it, it maybe it sounds, uh, uh, sketchy on my behalf, but I I don't shoot anything they won won't gimme. If you gimme a camera, I'll play with it. But to pick up a camera and shoot something and then give the camera back doesn't, it

Paris Chong: is weird, isn't

Greg Gorman: it?

Well, not really not, no, because you don't, the cost of like. I was to get a camera, then I'd want the camera for doing the pictures or whatever. But

Paris Chong: you're someone who deserves the camera.

Greg Gorman: Well, it's all good, but that's a great camera. I think the monochromatic camera's really awesome.

Paris Chong: So the other, so do a lot of the

Greg Gorman: cameras, the other cameras for me are not really for me, only because.

I'm getting old and they're heavy and the lenses are heavy. They're great cameras, they're works of art and, and I think they're great. And, uh, but I think, you know, I'm comfortable. I shoot with Sony and I shoot with So do they,

Paris Chong: so give you, does Sony give you a camera? Yeah. You just, I know, I hate to say this, but I, a lot of photographers say that, why don't they, it doesn't like, uh, uh, you know, they

Greg Gorman: give, give, they gimme a substantial discount, you know, so.

Yeah.

Paris Chong: Yeah. No. Well then that's, that's not, uh, hard to do.

Greg Gorman: Yeah,

Paris Chong: but would you want to,

Greg Gorman: I don't know. We can talk about it.

Paris Chong: Well, how do you stay so young and healthy and fit looking,

Greg Gorman: uh, people like you lose their eyesight. Know what they're really looking at. No, you

Paris Chong: listen.

Greg Gorman: No, you're the really good, you, you're very.

You

Paris Chong: look really good. And so, um, are you doing any traveling? I think you have

Greg Gorman: something. I just came back, uh, this morning from Temecula of all places. I'd never been there. You know, it's actually kind of an interesting place. I went down to look at some locations for a potential workshop.

Paris Chong: Yeah. It's wine

Greg Gorman: country, right?

And uh, yes, wine country. And, uh, it's actually much different than what I expected down there. 'cause it kind of gets a bad rap.

Paris Chong: Yeah. I've

Greg Gorman: never been. And it's actually kind of cool, you know? Is it? Yeah. It's like 90 minutes from LA and I went down to this horse ranch and it was, we had a. Pretty great time and it was quite beautiful.

Paris Chong: Did you have any wine?

Greg Gorman: Had some very good wine at dinner last night.

Paris Chong: What happened now? You used to have your own wine company?

Greg Gorman: Um, I made wine. I made wine from 2006 to 2018. Yeah. What was it called? Finny, GKG, which are my initials.

Paris Chong: So

Greg Gorman: I made a made Why did you

Paris Chong: stop? Made

Greg Gorman: Cabernet Blend. It was too much work, you know, I did it for a long time, sold very well, sold out every vintage, and then it got to the point that it was too much work and, and I, I bought very expensive fruit made of great wine and, uh.

To be honest, I mean, there's so many wines that are being made today, every day, new wineries, uh, and they, they got to where you could buy a great bottle of wine for a hell of a lesson buying a bottle of great Gorman wine. So really,

Paris Chong: what's your favorite wine?

Greg Gorman: Whatever's in my glass.

Paris Chong: That's a good, that's a good answer.

I like,

Greg Gorman: I mean, if I was talking about grape varietals, I would say Pinot Noir. Yeah, me too. And Sauvignon. Yeah.

Paris Chong: Hmm. So no more wine. And you're gonna be doing two books with Grace Jones and David Bowie. And you're teaching a class I think later this year.

Greg Gorman: I have a few classes coming up. Mm-hmm. I have a class, uh, one that I've been doing for many years, which is great.

Uh, in Maine, in Blenheim Park, Maine. With Carrie, uh, Payne Staley and her husband, uh, Justin, who is actually one of my sponsors with Fujifilm.

Paris Chong: It looks gorgeous.

That

Greg Gorman: spot. Oh, it's, and I'm a fisher, as you I know, know, I know. And so I'm staying right on a lake in a cabin. I mean, it's pretty hard to beat. It's a, it's not hard to do the math.

I get up early before the class starts fishing the morning as the sun's coming up, say goodnight to the class as the sun goes down, fish a little more. So I

Paris Chong: know. I think that's

Greg Gorman: so cool. It's a win-win situation. Yeah. And then I have a class in Aspen, Colorado, just a little bit previous to that.

Paris Chong: All very earthy, earthy things.

When's your birthday?

Greg Gorman: June 7th

Paris Chong: Uhhuh. So

Greg Gorman: 76, 19 49. There you got all the, all the specifics. Yeah.

Paris Chong: Yeah. So, um, let's talk a little bit about your portraiture. So do you have a favorite subject?

Greg Gorman: Um, you know, it's just, it's whoever's in front of my lens if it's like

Paris Chong: your wine.

Greg Gorman: Like my wine. No. I mean, you know, subjects for me are people that are, uh, complacent to do what I ask 'em to do.

People that are not hung up on their looks and that are a little bit more open. Um, I find people that are too caught up in how they have to appear, what, what the approach has to be are not so interesting to photograph. Mm-hmm. People that take themselves too seriously. Not so interesting to photograph, you know, so.

Want a person that's an open mind and willing to play and have fun. Yeah. You know, spontaneity is such an important part of creating a, a strong portrait.

Paris Chong: So do you, do you have a favorite model?

Greg Gorman: Oh, I have many that I work with. I mean, you know, you know, I shoot more, uh, personalities than I do fashion. I was, you know, Matthew's a little bit more of a fashion, uh, photographer than I was.

I was more personality.

Paris Chong: So are you, do you still go out and shoot all the time now?

Greg Gorman: I shoot more for myself. I don't work commercially too much anymore. A little bit now, and then there's jobs here and there that I do, I still do my LAI Works campaign. Mm-hmm. You know, I still have a, a, a, a stronghold on a handful of celebrities that I've shot over the years, you know, that I still work with.

But I made a conscious choice around 2006, 2007 that I'd kind of been there, done that. I think with the onset of digital, it really changed, uh. One, my outlook on how things go, and I think it got to the point. I know that like around 2006, seven, I was bidding jobs and I bid four or five jobs and then, uh, down to the wire, we'd packed everything up ready to go.

I shouldn't be saying this, but it, that's the truth. And, and then. The day before we're leaving, the producers went with another photographer. They got a Greg Gorman lookalike, oh no. You know, style wise for 10 cents on the dollar. And it got to the point where they really didn't care because with digital, they could go and alter the pictures to make them look enough like the celebrity.

And it wasn't about getting that really important connected portrait, which is what I focused on pretty much throughout my career, to really get inside the person's head and get a. A sense of the soul of who that individual was. And you look at a lot of the stuff today and it's just kind like,

Paris Chong: I know it's changed

Greg Gorman: a

Paris Chong: lot,

Greg Gorman: hasn't it?

Nobody. Nobody's changed a

Paris Chong: lot that the business has changed

Greg Gorman: a a lot. Yeah. With ai, it's hideous, you know?

Paris Chong: I know. Did you have an agent out here?

Greg Gorman: I had agents years ago at the beginning of my career. It's funny. And, and, uh, they,

Paris Chong: that's another, another thing that seems to have gone away.

Greg Gorman: Well, I, yeah, well, I mean, I had agents, you know, many years ago, and I had one agent that was, uh, my rep for many years.

And, uh, she said to me at one point, she says, you know, Greg, you need to reinvent yourself. And I go, why the fuck would I wanna reinvent myself? I'd spent 40 years trying to figure out who Greg Gorman is building a brand and a style. What the fuck do I wanna redo? Find a new Greg Gorman. I think that it made no ter, she was gone the next day.

That was the end of that relationship.

Paris Chong: That's a rude thing to say to somebody.

Greg Gorman: Well, I dunno whether it's rude, but it wasn't anything I had any particular interest in. I mean, I spent a long time to develop my style. I think if you look at a lot of the great photographers, you look at Avid on or, or, uh. You know, any, any of the really greats pen, you know, you know when you see a pen or an Avedon picture.

Yeah. So why would I want to alter what I've spent, you know, my career defining, so to

speak.

Paris Chong: Yeah. Plus you've always evolved. It's like you always can tell

Greg Gorman: a perform you evolve style change. And I mean, I found, you know, I got a little bit more interested. I always jokingly say I was still alive.

Photography, tell people to sit down an old still, but at the end of the day, in some of the later projects I've done, I've found sometimes the more interesting picture when I go back and revisit some of the earlier work or those moments in between. Interesting because it was a different perception growing older and, and seeing things in a different light.

So that was kind of a, a fun thing when I did the book. It's not about me. I found pictures that normally,

Paris Chong: oh, somebody said that it's not about you. And that's John Water said that. Yeah.

Greg Gorman: It's all about you. Oh, it's, it's all about you.

Paris Chong: It's all about you. It's your book.

Greg Gorman: But, uh, so then, you know, so at that point then, you know, you, you go back and you revisit your earlier work and you kind of reassess it.

Paris Chong: Yeah. So do you, um, now sp I I, I've, I've heard about your, um, famous dinner parties.

Greg Gorman: Crazy. I

Paris Chong: know,

Greg Gorman: I, it's a funny story. I used, I, I always, uh, you know, when I was more the flavor of the month, I mean, I used to really have some pretty incredible dinner parties with crazy dinner guests. And, uh, you know, in the early part, it's actually one of the reasons, you know, I love to cook.

And in the earlier days, I mean, I had pretty heavy duty group of people and, and I'm, I'm, I'm a. Person that's very eclectic. I gotta have a hustler from Santa Monica Boulevard and I gotta have Bette Midler or David Bowie, you know, or, or Iggy or, or Brian Fer or any of these, you know, John Waters and all complete Heidi Fleiss comes to almost every dinner party I had.

She was at a dinner party last,

Paris Chong: I just saw this. I just saw the

Greg Gorman: pictures I to her this morning. Yeah, she was at a dinner party last weekend. You know, some guests will say, why would you have Heidi fle to dinner? And then at the dinner party, when it's over they go. She was the coolest guest you've ever had at a dinner party.

So I love just mixing.

Paris Chong: Do you, do you make your, do you cook, cook fish that you catch?

Greg Gorman: Um, I do. When I keep them. I don't keep much. You don't keep 'em? No. I pretty much catch and release for everything. When I had my home in Mendocino, you know, on the coast, and I would go out salmon fishing, I would keep the king salmon.

Paris Chong: Yeah.

Greg Gorman: But I mean, you know, I fish for, you know, red fish, which are delicious to eat. But the guy, I have a adorable guy that we fish with. Uh, my best buddy Kent Flory and I fish with on the East coast, just a great guy and he's a. Tremendous guy. And you know, he is a very passionate, uh, conservationist and he, you know, he doesn't want to have kill the fish.

So you don't kill the fish. I'd rather catch

Paris Chong: don't you when you hook him, don't they?

Greg Gorman: John Waters always jokes. Yeah. You don't kill the fish, you drag the poor fucking things through the water until they've ripped their lip open. No, but that's not true. Mm-hmm. And I rarely, we've rarely ever lost a fish.

I shouldn't say we've never lost a fish. Mm-hmm. And obviously if we've lost a fish, um, we've kept 'em in the guide or someone's eaten it, but most of the time, um, they're pretty okay. What's your favorite

Paris Chong: thing to cook?

Greg Gorman: Um, I learned how to cook a lot of great Italian dishes through my buddies in Kansas City that own an Italian restaurant back there that I always go to Jasper's, uh, uh, kitchen in Kansas City.

And, uh, I go there, Jasper's, Marco Polo. It's a great restaurant in Kansas City. Mm-hmm. And I've been lifelong friends with a Monopoly family, and so I love his cooking. So he is taught me how to make so many great, you know, I

Paris Chong: love

Greg Gorman: Italian food, pasta dishes. Yeah. And he's,

Paris Chong: where do, do you have a favorite place you go to eat here?

Greg Gorman: Um, it's funny, I don't find the Italian restaurants here as great as in in some of the other cities a lot, but there's a few good ones here. I mean, I like, uh, I like Kodo Venetta. I like, uh oh, that's

Paris Chong: great.

Greg Gorman: Antica Nvo,

Paris Chong: lado Venetta by the Sea Cedars.

Greg Gorman: Yeah. I love, it's still really great and it's a great atmosphere, you know,

Paris Chong: love

Greg Gorman: to, I still go there quite often.

Paris Chong: Love. They have a great lunch special. Did you know,

Greg Gorman: I know they have a. But my brother was always coming up to like, where can I go eat at 11 o'clock in the morning and go to nda, venetta? It's open early. Um, but they're great and it's a great food, great restaurant, and it's a charming spot, you know?

Paris Chong: Yeah. I, the only thing is they won't let disco in, so that's why I'm like, oh.

Greg Gorman: Oh, they wouldn't,

Paris Chong: they will let disco in there. Well,

Greg Gorman: you can sit on the patio. I

Paris Chong: like it a little.

Greg Gorman: I like the little nooks and front window. Yeah, they're great. But it's a great, it's a fun restaurant. Yeah.

Paris Chong: So what's next for Greg Gorman besides the book? Are you planning any other crazy things?

Greg Gorman: You know, just a few trips.

New York for John's 80th birthday in April. And, uh, I teach at SVA every year, uh, in New York. Uh, this will be, I think my 20th year. I teach a course there. Oh, that's, that's good. That started with Katrina Eisman and myself at the, do you like teaching master thesis course? I do. I love teaching. That's what I do with my life.

Does

Paris Chong: Matthew loves it.

Greg Gorman: I teach, you know, all the time. I mean, that's really what I, that's my main, my main income is really teaching and selling prints.

Paris Chong: That's cool. So, so face

Greg Gorman: most of my com uh, photography work is just personal work now these

Paris Chong: days. Yeah. Well, I, um, was so lucky to be invited to your 70th birthday party.

That was a really fun party a while ago. That was a beautiful party. That wasn't that long ago, was it?

Greg Gorman: Which was that up at by

Paris Chong: Richard's? It was that beautiful house up in off of Mulholland.

Greg Gorman: Yeah.

Paris Chong: There was so many people that all, uh, Diane Lane was there and, uh, Pierce was, was a good friend. She, she's so beautiful in person.

Mm-hmm. Like she's beautiful on screen, but

Greg Gorman: obvious. Yeah. And you know, she star, I gotta tell you, she starred in, I think one of the very best films of the year. Which very few people have seen. I think that, uh, I gotta say I don't have a lot of appreciation for Lionsgate Films who made the film. Um, because they also made Catherine Bigelow's film, uh, her locker, which they just didn't really get behind at the beginning.

They were worried about the movie, I guess. And I know Catherine called me and said, would I come to New York and shoot Jeremy Renner? For pictures, for the, for the movie. 'cause they didn't really have any really good art and, and Lionsgate didn't really want to get behind it and we did it. And of course she won the Academy Award and it won best picture.

And likewise this picture that Diane Lang just made, which I think is a masterpiece and it's called Anniversary and Lionsgate made it anniversary. Well, you would never see it. They've buried the film and, uh, basically, uh. Diane had a q and a out here, which I went to and saw the film, and you can buy it on Amazon, I think, or Apple, I should say.

I'll for $10 or whatever it is. And it's an extraordinary movie, but it's about a dystopian society, so it's basically Trump's story without it being told. And I think maybe Lionsgate was too nervous about this prick, you know, just waiting for that man to die. I wish it would be sooner than later.

Paris Chong: Well, I'm glad you

Greg Gorman: said that.

I must say. Well, I'll say it. I mean, I can't stand, it's just destroyed. Destroyed everything's,

Paris Chong: it's absolutely everything. Not even normal what's happening at all. It's, it's

Greg Gorman: no, and people are so afraid of him and I mean, you know, he is got his three hookers in office and drunks and drug addicts. I mean, who would've ever thought 20 years ago that this would be the country we're living in today?

Paris Chong: I know I can't, I, I can't believe, uh, that this is happening. It really blows my mind. And we're losing so many good people. 'cause everyone's moving abroad.

Greg Gorman: A lot of people are moving abroad.

Paris Chong: Don't ha don't, I had so many friends. All at the time.

Greg Gorman: Nobody wants to be part of this. And, and the thing is, you know, the muscle he carries that people are afraid of their own shadow.

It's just, you know, nothing's getting better. It's just getting worse.

Paris Chong: It's really bad. I have a lot of friends that just left because of this and, um, pat, pat Lanza was planning to leave. She's the only one that, I'm not sorry. For everyone else. I'm like, you're leaving. You get,

she

Greg Gorman: sent Cody in Lake Como.

Yeah.

Paris Chong: No, she, I, I talked to her. She's like, Paris. She goes, I don't, I'm gonna go. I'm seeing her in, uh, the summer.

Greg Gorman: You know, it's funny. We were boyfriend and girlfriend back Shocking back in college days. Well, it all flipped, but it's funny. But we're great friends, you know, and, and, uh, we've been great friends.

I can't even, many, many can't guys

Paris Chong: together as boyfriend and girlfriend.

Greg Gorman: Well, it was in the SE early seventies, you know?

Paris Chong: Really?

Greg Gorman: Yeah. But, uh, but Pat's great.

Paris Chong: How long

Greg Gorman: did you date? No, we, we went out during college days and stuff. It was, it was more just kind of a fun

Paris Chong: thing. It was a sexual thing.

Greg Gorman: Not really.

I mean, we slept together, but we wasn't real sexual. I love story, but we were great friends. You know, story and, and I, I adore Pat and, and you know, I know her as Midge. Midge. Yeah. But did you ever hear that? No. That was her nickname Midge. Everybody called

Paris Chong: her Midge. No, but I called her mama one time and she said, don't call me that.

Greg Gorman: Yeah, no. Yeah. That's very Pat. Yeah. No, she

Paris Chong: was like, don't hold me that her. And we were there. I'm like, sorry, was everybody called

Greg Gorman: Midge? 'cause she was so little.

Paris Chong: Yeah. Oh, I love Pat. So she called me and she said. Oh, Paris. I don't even, she, I was gonna buy a house, but I found this beautiful, uh, I got an eight year lease.

Have you talked to her? She got an eight year lease, not in the last few weeks year. I talked to her. That's great. For this gorgeous place. I'm gonna see her in July after our That's so great. I know. And she's so, but she was the one. Friend that was move, was planning to move anyways before all the fires and all this chaos and ace and wool,

Greg Gorman: knowing one of her other best friends, who's a dear friend of mine, Paul Birdie, she's moved to, uh, Portugal, so he's,

Paris Chong: a lot of people are moving

Greg Gorman: Portugal.

He's outside of, uh, outside of Lisbon. Yeah,

Paris Chong: I know. I would like to move to Portugal too. If I had any reason to go somewhere, I'd go. I wanna, he's

Greg Gorman: beautiful. Yeah.

Paris Chong: Well, do you, are you, do you have

Greg Gorman: I spend a lot of time in Europe. I mean, I spend at least two months a year in Europe. You do? Every year I have.

It's kinda like Groundhog Day. I always teach in New York in May, late May. For SVA, and then I go to Europe for a couple of months, and generally I do a workshop up in the Dolomites, but we've done like a half a dozen up there, so I need to find a new venue for me over there. I've taught in Norway. I wanted to get back into doing some stuff up in Christensen, which is a beautiful island, about an hour from Oslo, which is a great.

We, I've done some great workshops there.

Paris Chong: Yeah. You, you know, I went to see, um, Hossein asked me to come and give an award out in Greece for the House of Lucy.

Greg Gorman: Oh really?

Paris Chong: Yeah. So I went and I saw your photo There he is. Like Greg gave me, we caught this from Greg and, uh, it was so good to see him. You know, I used to run his gallery.

Did you know that?

Greg Gorman: No, I didn't.

Paris Chong: Yeah. I used to run from Mon Gallery. I've

Greg Gorman: been Hussein and, and Susan Barez Barez. I

Paris Chong: love

Greg Gorman: her. You know, I've known her from back in the days of Antonio Lopez in New York for

Yeah.

Greg Gorman: Many, many years. We were friends with Antonio and Juan. Don and Paul. All of,

Paris Chong: yeah.

Greg Gorman: All of his, the good old days, factory days when Andy was there at the factory.

Yeah, it was great.

Paris Chong: I would, I would've lo I think I just missed all that good fun like Studio 54. I think it would've fit right in, in that crowd.

Greg Gorman: Yeah, it was fine. It was

Paris Chong: days, but I didn't get to say it was, I just missed it. But, um, I got to hang out

Greg Gorman: with my first night at, uh, at, uh. Studio 54. I went with, uh, Cindy Hall, Jerry Hall's sister

Paris Chong: Oh, wow.

Greg Gorman: To dinner at Francesco ULAs. And we all went over to Studio 54 after dinner, which was kind of great.

Paris Chong: I'm glad you brought, you know that that's my, my favorite photographer.

Greg Gorman: He is. He was a nice man. I love photos. He and Sean, we all went to Studio 54 after, uh, after dinner.

Paris Chong: His, he was the first. That was the first photo book I ever bought.

I was like a teenager. Yeah. I was fan. He, because I loved him. 'cause he did all the cosmopolitan covers. Right. You know, so I was a young girl and everybody loved Cosmopolitan and they used to have the best horoscopes in there, and it was just like the best thing on the, on the planet. And I loved, uh, GIA.

So she, and I mean, I couldn't believe how beautiful she was when I saw that cover. So I, I, I bought, I remember I was, I probably wasn't even 17 and I bought a Francesco Sula book that I still have till this day. I loved how he did like all that, that grainy look.

Greg Gorman: Right.

Paris Chong: You know how he made it grain?

Greg Gorman: Well, he probably shot Trix.

He probably just shot a, you know, a lower

Paris Chong: resolution.

Greg Gorman: He so

Paris Chong: fabulous. I'm so glad. So you knew him and you hung out with him at Studio 54. I'm jealous.

Greg Gorman: Yeah.

Paris Chong: Was he nice?

Greg Gorman: Yeah, he was really nice.

Paris Chong: He wasn't a diva or, as I said,

Greg Gorman: I never knew him very well, you know, uh, Cindy invited me to dinner and said, you wanna go to dinner at?

Francesco s Scilla. I said yes.

Paris Chong: I didn't even know Jerry Hall had a sister. Is it true that

Greg Gorman: she had, they have six or seven sisters? Jesus. I think he think it's a big family. Texas. I think Texas, I believe that's a pretty big family.

Paris Chong: So is it true that people were just like blatantly having sex up in the rooms and stuff?

Greg Gorman: Oh, there was a little bit of everything going.

Paris Chong: Really? Yeah.

Greg Gorman: The

Paris Chong: good old days. Right.

Greg Gorman: And it was, it was great. Liza

Paris Chong: Minelli

Greg Gorman: also, well, it was the old, it was the old I, CCB s playoffs or something. And so it was like big. Sta, uh, seats and stuff that went all the way up. And then there was the floor and then, you know, seating, seating areas down below.

Paris Chong: So, and I don't think people realize it didn't even stay open that long. It was like a two year run or something, right? Yeah.

Greg Gorman: Maybe longer than that, but

Paris Chong: that 78

Greg Gorman: eighties,

Paris Chong: it wasn't something, something like that wasn't like a long standing, uh, place like, you know, some of these other clubs. So I'm glad you got to do that.

Greg Gorman: Yeah.

Paris Chong: you have pictures of it

Greg Gorman: from there now?

Paris Chong: No. When did you start shooting?

Greg Gorman: I was shooting, then of course I started

Paris Chong: taking picture it just sitting out there.

Greg Gorman: Yeah.

Paris Chong: Do you know Merril, Meiser? Meiser mc, Meryl Meer. She took a lot of photos at Studio two, four. Yeah. She took the picture of Bianca on the horse.

Greg Gorman: Oh really?

Paris Chong: Okay.

Greg Gorman: Yeah, I know the

Paris Chong: picture. She's awesome. I got to meet her when it was in New York, la uh, last time. She's very awesome. So who's your favorite photographer?

Greg Gorman: Oh, who do I really love? I mean, I was always a huge fan of Richard Abdon. I'm a big fan of, uh, Harrell. I love hero's work. Um. John Paul Barbie, I love, you know, there's a lot.

Paris Chong: Who

Greg Gorman: do you think is overrated? I really love Albert Watson's work. I think Albert Watson's just an amazing photographer.

Paris Chong: Who do you think's overrated?

Greg Gorman: I wouldn't say that

Paris Chong: you wouldn't.

Greg Gorman: No. I don't think that there's anybody, any benefits to put people down or to say somebody's bad. You know, some

Paris Chong: people are though.

Don't you think?

Greg Gorman: There's people I definitely like better than others, but they're not, I, there's no reason to really talk about it. It doesn't make anybody, it doesn't make me, me a That's nice. Doesn't make me a better

Paris Chong: person

Greg Gorman: I thought.

Paris Chong: I know, I thought maybe you'd go there because you get, because you know you have your opinions about things, which I like about you.

Oh, I have my

Greg Gorman: opinions

Paris Chong: about You're not, and you're not scared to say them.

Greg Gorman: No, I'm not. But there's no real reason to go down that road.

Paris Chong: So do you, so do you have an art show coming up at Fahe Climb with the book?

Greg Gorman: Um, well, no, nothing's planned at this point. And we're working on some, a couple of European things, but, uh.

You know, the book is, um, we have scanned all the black and whites of David and Grace. Nothing's been finalized, retouching, that's just starting and they're just, and uh, Nicole is just starting to scan the color, so we're way out.

Paris Chong: Do you like doing art shows or

Greg Gorman: do you Yeah, I love having my gallery shows. I love doing that.

Do, yeah. And I've had a lot of shows with David. He's been my galls from the beginning and loved. He was originally with g Ray Hawkins and he had a gallery together and then David Split and I went with David.

Paris Chong: That's good. You made the

Greg Gorman: right decision. But he's been great. Yeah, he's been great. And, uh. You know, he has the best staff and great people.

Paris Chong: The

Greg Gorman: sales

Paris Chong: have been picking up, I've noticed.

Greg Gorman: Yeah. I mean, I think he's kind of turned it over to the crew there and they're, they're out there doing a really good job and Heather's been doing a great job.

Paris Chong: Yeah, after the fires was awful. Yeah.

Greg Gorman: Yeah. I had my, uh, my last chauffeur, it's not about me during COVID, which was a nightmare because they could only have a couple of people in the gallery at a time.

So they'd call me at home, so and so's coming down to the gallery, can you come down? I was making two and three trips a day to the gallery to give people a tour of the show.

Paris Chong: So what do you want people to remember you for, like, uh, when they think about Greg Gorman?

Greg Gorman: Well, I mean, hopefully they'll remember me from my work.

I, I, um. Basically, uh, and, you know, set up, I've set up a foundation to kind of keep my name alive. I decided not to sell my archives. I think no, a lot of people have sold them and, uh, I just want to have more control. That's good. I'm, I'm control freak. So are you. I set up a charitable foundation to keep, you know, my name alive and, you know, hopefully people remember me from my black and white photography, I suppose for my harsh lighting, my strong highlights and hard shadows and kind of sculptured lighting.

And from my, uh. Fine art, male and female nudes, you know, that sort of stuff.

Paris Chong: Yeah. If there is, if you had, I know this is a hard question, it's like asking what your favorite song is, but like if there's one photo that you're the most proud of that you find to be your most iconic image, what would it

Greg Gorman: be?

Well, I mean, I think it's the shot of Andy Warhol, which is a, a funny story because, uh, I was working, doing LAI works, which is one of the defining. That

Paris Chong: is a good shot.

Greg Gorman: Uh, pieces of work in my career, I suppose you could say. I've shot a couple hundred ads for them and, uh, they appeared every month in Interview Magazine and I was shooting a lot of coverage for Interview Magazine back in the day.

And, uh, Andy called me up and he had just signed a deal with, uh, Ford Modeling and he studied, I don't know if you know that, Andy Kinda, no, I don't. A stutter. And you said, uh, Greg is Andy. Um, do you think that, uh, that uh. That, uh, uh, that, uh, LAI works would like me. You want me for an LAI works at? And I said, yeah, I think they probably would.

And I shot those pictures and, you know, unbeknownst to me at the time, that became probably as a commercial work, probably my most significant image, one of 'em certainly.

Paris Chong: And it's a really good one. So where can we see all these images?

Greg Gorman: Either on my website or Google my name, you'll

Paris Chong: find my name. Yeah. This guy is like insanely, insanely talented and I do love that picture.

Andy Warhol. I got to meet him backstage at a culture club concert in the eighties with, and he was with Debbie Harry and I someone, Deb is a real good

Greg Gorman: friend of

Paris Chong: mine. She's awesome. Yeah, she's a close friend of mine. She's awesome. And she, they, someone took a Polaroid of us that was this amazing Polaroid, and you know how you stick a Polaroid in your mirror at your house?

I wasn't thinking how amazing it was that I'd have that one day and someone, I had a party and someone stole it. I was

Greg Gorman: so, so sad. I know. That's so frustrating.

Paris Chong: Yeah. So I got to meet him, but he didn't talk that much, so I didn't notice the

Greg Gorman: stutter. Well, he was quiet. Yeah, but he was funny because he would come out, he was like a wallflower.

And when he would come to la, sometimes he'd call me, what's happening, Greg? What clubs were happening? And I would sometimes take him out to a club and he'd kinda just stand in the when the milk milk. Club, the milk bar, whatever it was Yeah,

Paris Chong: yeah.

Greg Gorman: Was on, I took him there a few times and uh, I remember one time Annie Lennox was there, so that was great.

And well, he would just kinda stand back in the corner. Yeah. I remember. Just kind of observe. He was an observer. Yeah.

Paris Chong: Yeah. So do you, are you always gonna stay in la.

Greg Gorman: Am I always gonna stay in Ellie? I'm too old to move at this house. You've been to my house? No, I'm too old to, no,

because

Paris Chong: I and

Greg Gorman: I come, never been to my,

Paris Chong: I wanna come to the, you

Greg Gorman: invited me for the book signing.

Yeah. There's not a square inch of wall space. It's like, it's uh, I guess you could say I'm a hoarder. There's this every, I wanna come to the next dinner party. Okay. All we have to find a good one. We had a good one recently had a, I would've love

Paris Chong: to been there with

Greg Gorman: Heidi for Joey Arias. Yeah. We had Joey Arias and Kenny Sharp and Anne Magnuson.

Kind of a real interesting kind of off the wall.

Paris Chong: It looked, it looked

Greg Gorman: a group. And Heidi of course was there. Yeah.

Paris Chong: What'd you make for dinner?

Greg Gorman: What did I make for? Well, you know what? That's, you're always at the mercy of the, uh, lowest common denominator at the table for what you can make that people will eat.

So I think that that was a very simple. Dinner with like grilled chicken and you know, vegetables and stuff like that. Pretty straightforward. It wasn't one of my fancier dinners with either, uh, you know, one of the pastas I learned to make from Jasper in Kansas City or some other things.

Paris Chong: Mm-hmm. And how's your love life?

Greg Gorman: Well, I don't usually discuss that too much online, but it's actually, it's actually the best it's been since 2019. It's God, one week. So I love, I'm very happy. We'll, where it goes. You don't wanna jinx these things to talk too much about it. But yes, at the moment it's uh, pretty, pretty unbelievable. I'm pretty happy about that.

Paris Chong: Wow. Well, thank you for

Greg Gorman: sharing. So that's kind of exciting for an old man. Yeah,

Paris Chong: yeah, I know. Well, you look so good. I mean,

Greg Gorman: come

Paris Chong: on. No,

Greg Gorman: you're kind.

Paris Chong: No, you're awesome. You're life

Greg Gorman: affirming.

Paris Chong: No, you're the best. You're the best. And thank you so much for making time. Can I take you to La Conda Banana? Not today, but.

Next week? Or is it Sure we could

Greg Gorman: do that

Paris Chong: at some point. Let's go. Let's go. I would, I would take you, uh, today, but I have to Uber all over

Greg Gorman: or I've got a dinner. I got a dinner tonight with a bunch, bunch of friends. Friends. I'm gonna go up to Pache tonight, which I like to

Paris Chong: Oh,

Greg Gorman: you ever, ever go out there? Oh,

Paris Chong: I love that place.

Greg Gorman: Paches great. Yeah. So I'm, I'm up there, but I do eat and look on

Paris Chong: ETT all the time. That's a great spot. Um, uh,

Greg Gorman: Apache's fun pache on the patio. Yeah. I never sit inside. I sit on the patios really

Paris Chong: great. I wanna go there. You know, the owner is lovely.

Greg Gorman: He left right.

Paris Chong: What?

Greg Gorman: Uh, the, the one guy that was the main guy

Paris Chong: that, the young guy,

Greg Gorman: huh?

Paris Chong: He's a younger guy.

Greg Gorman: Yeah, he is fairly young. The guy, there's a ma main Maer D there. I think he went to open and if I'm not mistaken,

Paris Chong: he owns it. Not the Mare d. He owned

Greg Gorman: it. Well the Maitre D's the one who, what's his name? That's the one I know.

Paris Chong: I'm blanking on his name, but he approached me to do a pop-up there.

Okay. He wanted to put some art in there and we were talking about it Then I never, then he kind of ghosted me. Yeah. Which is fine 'cause I'm so busy.

Greg Gorman: People Ghost. Yeah. The guy I knew, I think went and opened a restaurant in the family, but a different guy who was really great. He was a ma eat. Yeah.

Pat's

Paris Chong: great.

That was by Pat's old house.

Greg Gorman: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Not far from where she

Paris Chong: lives. Well, we have to go see Pat.

Greg Gorman: I know. I want to go visit her at some point.

Paris Chong: I'm gonna be there in July.

Greg Gorman: You're right. Yeah. I'm probably, I'll probably, I'm not, I haven't really, since I'm not teaching in the Dolomites this year in Europe.

Um, I'm trying to figure out what I, where I, I'm, I'm like a, I go to the same cities every year. It's so boring. I Sure. But, you know, I love, I love bologna, and I love, uh, I love London. I I love Hamburg. You know? Yeah. And I love up in some of the Scandinavian countries.

Paris Chong: And you have friends all over the place?

Greg Gorman: I do.

Paris Chong: And you were in Dubai with Jeff, wasn't Jeff

Greg Gorman: Gymnast there? Yeah, I helped. I got Jeff that show. Yeah,

Paris Chong: Jeff was here. He was telling

Greg Gorman: me

Paris Chong: about

Greg Gorman: it. He said it was a trip. Yeah, I got him. That show. Amazing. Yeah, there's a guy named, uh, Simon Newton who coordinates at I wanna go. He's extraordinary and I wanna go

Paris Chong: to that.

Greg Gorman: I've had two shows over there and, uh, they've been great. Quite an extraordinary gentleman and he manages to navigate the world of photography and bring the greatest photo from all over the world. I've heard of great things about it, and he puts the things together and the wall color, the carpet, the layout, the design, framing, everything.

He's an absolute master and uh, it's an incredible festival that I don't think enough people know about. And I wanna definitely plug it. It's called exposure.

Paris Chong: Yeah.

Greg Gorman: I wanna, I, and who knows, you know, you have these. Predefined ideas of what the Middle East is gonna be like. Dubai and Abu Dhabi and Sharjah.

This is fabulous. I had an amazing time. This is in Sharjah, which is considered the cultural capital of the Emirates.

Paris Chong: And Karen Ballard was there too.

Greg Gorman: I got Karen, the, you, I got quite a few of the photographers in there. Karen, Karen, Jeff, uh, Gard. Ludvig.

Paris Chong: Mm-hmm. Um,

Greg Gorman: I got a lot of my buddies over there, so he calls me and I give him a few names every year.

Paris Chong: Oh, that's

Greg Gorman: good. And uh. It's an exceptional experience and it is so well put together and so organized. It's truly mind boggling. It's a huge, massive thing. He has like 75 photographers, a hundred photographers, if you can imagine. They're all big names. For me, it, you know, I'm such a people person that, uh.

It's, it was very exciting for me to have shows there. 'cause I met so many photographers from walks of life. I'd never meet the first night. I was at dinner, uh, there this past year when I had a show. I'm sitting across as from this really attractive girl and we're having this conversation, what's your name?

My name's Pippa, who I'm gonna see this coming week actually. And I said, oh, do you have something going on? He says, yes, I. Produced and directed the Octopus. Teach my Octopus teacher, and I just flipped out. You can imagine. 'cause I love that movie. I've never eaten octopus since I saw that movie. And so she and I became great friends.

I met so many fascinating photographers out there. You know, in general, in our, our world here in Hollywood was so insular. You'd never have the opportunity of meeting some of these extraordinary people. And I met so many, I mean, fabulous people I've stayed in touch with most of 'em.

Paris Chong: Did they have people doing portfolio reviews there?

Greg Gorman: Um,

Paris Chong: I wanna go.

Greg Gorman: I don't think so.

Paris Chong: No, they need to, then I can go. That's what

Greg Gorman: I'd do. Yeah, that would be something great. Yeah. Yeah.

Paris Chong: That's what I was doing for, I did that for, um, Hossein when I went to Greece to the House of Lucy. And then I did that at ar, which was really fun. And I got to meet Howard Greenberg walking around on the streets,

Greg Gorman: right?

Paris Chong: He got me into a private party. This girl wasn't gonna let me and my gorgeous girlfriend Shannon in, and we were like, well, let's just, let's just wing it and pretend we're on the list and we Paris, Chong, Leica. I said, oh, you're not on the list. I'm like, oh, how embarrassing. And as we walk around the corner and there's Howard and she's like, oh my God, he has my favorite gal.

And I'm like, hi, I, uh, um, I have Paris, blah, blah, blah. Oh, you know, we, we were trying to go to that party. He goes, well, I'm staying at the hotel. And I'm like, oh. And then we just kind of started walking with him, and then he went up to the front and it's like, um, they're with me and the girl's like, yeah, they're not on the list.

And um, I'm like, what is this New York circa 1970? I'm like, right's crazy. Who cares? We're in a little tiny French town. Exactly. Why are you being such a bitch? And so she, he's like, no, they're my guess. With me. I'm staying in the hotel. And she's like, yeah, but they're not on the list. And he's like, I wanna talk to the manager.

And then she, she just like, begrudgingly let us in. So we got to go to the fabulous party. I got to see the owner of Leica. I'm like, hi. And um, uh, uh, Roger Ballin, who was gonna do a show with us next year. I love Roger. He's coming next year.

Greg Gorman: Oh, that's great. Well, he's great.

Paris Chong: He's amazing.

Greg Gorman: He's great. He's a great, uh, lecturer.

Mm-hmm. His work's extraordinary. I particularly love his work a lot. I'm big. Big fan.

Paris Chong: Yeah, he's coming next year, but I just wanna make sure he can be here. I don't like doing shows with people not here anymore. It just

Greg Gorman: make sense. I, I met him, uh, thanks to Jeff Dunes from Jeff Jeff's workshops in palm swings.

Paris Chong: Yeah, that was really fun. I'm glad I crashed that party. That was good.

Greg Gorman: Yeah. Yeah.

Paris Chong: Do you ever go to oral?

Greg Gorman: You know, I, I was just gonna say to you, I've never been to a it's great. Or para pinera, any of 'em. It's so silly. I don't know why I've never been, but never been to any of those things. Well, I'm out of the loop, I think, in terms of all those places.

I don't dunno why it doesn't

Paris Chong: sound like you're outta the loop at all the places you are going. Well, I just want, I just am so thrilled you came and thank you so much. It means. The world to me.

Greg Gorman: Oh my pleasure.

Paris Chong: Anytime.

Greg Gorman: Yeah.

Paris Chong: I also wanted to thank my girlfriend, Eva, for getting me these little camera earrings.

Did you see these?

Oh,

Greg Gorman: those

Paris Chong: are pretty cool. Present. Cool. They present at a estate sale for Jolie Fisher. Thank you Jolie Fisher. I love 'em. I'm the gallery director of like, and now have your camera earrings.

Greg Gorman: That's great. Well, thank you so much. I, Eva coming to your openings at the

Paris Chong: gallery. They're

Greg Gorman: always

Paris Chong: a great event and I'm taking you lunch and we're gonna have some wine and we're gonna have a good time.

Greg Gorman: That sounds like a

Paris Chong: plan. Okay. Thank you everyone for listening. We'll see what one more.

Greg Gorman: Well, you know, yeah, we

Paris Chong: can, yeah. How, what's your website?

Greg Gorman: I think, you know, well, the website is, uh, gorman photography.com.

Paris Chong: Okay.

Greg Gorman: And I do have two workshops coming up. I highly recommend my workshop in Maine. Uh, Blenheim Park.

I use, it fills up pretty quick. Yeah. Because I always, uh, I get the same. I, I must be a bad teacher 'cause I always get the same view. They come every year, but this year, yeah. They're

fans.

Greg Gorman: I book a couple extraordinary models that I'm bringing in. One of the boys that I photographed in the Dolomites, who's beautiful, who's coming into model, saw him gorgeous.

And I'm bringing, uh, Stephanie Moore in, who's modeled for me many years in Mendocino. She's now a professional photographer and great, but she's doing this as a favor to me. So killer models, great locations. And then I have a, a workshop that's portraiture only, uh, that'll be in Aspen, Colorado. And it's on your website, Anderson Ranch.

Um, they're getting up on the website now. They'll be up. That's, uh. Uh, the Blenheim Park, the one in Maine is uh, at the very end, I believe, of October and the one in Aspen I believe is at near the end of uh, August.

Paris Chong: Okay, well it sounds like you have a really great, they'll

Greg Gorman: be on the website and you can see it from there.

Paris Chong: Great life. You have a great life.

Greg Gorman: Well, thank you for the plug and thank you for your time.

Paris Chong: Yeah, no, thank you. Okay, bye.

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